The ultimate dual 500 "rising from the ashes" build

grapplesaw

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So where did you check bias??
Lee in order to get easy bias readings I added to test points onto to control board connected to the base wire which is correct but I put the other end to ground instead of hot output.

So so bias is very stable.

Problem for for today is blowing rail fuses when connected to load
I used some 1-1/4 fuses for set up which did well until I added the 8 ohm load. They blow on power on with no signal amplitude. I will increase to 2 amp and try again or power on then plug in the load. The 1-1/4 amp fuse will hold up to 6 volts output on a 700. With in built in DCP relay it may hammer to initial current when engaged. As this is a radicle build I have moved very slow on trying to fast as there are a lot of drivers there to replace
 

grapplesaw

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Here is what it will look like after the gremlins leave. DCP circuit engaging. High temp light on but circuit closed through temp censor. Oscilloscope showed a very low sine wave in faint background of 1k signal, not sure if it existed . Have to determine what is going on. Broke the high temp diode when I rolled the unit. Great day but it still looks good.
 

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Northwinds

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I think Ed is moving not far from me, I know he said he was moving to Connecticut

I wondered if PL analog meters would go right in> I think 700B meters would look bitchin in the series 2 700s and Dual 500s
 

laatsch55

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Glen , I was talking to Ed yesterday and there are at least one and possibly two full comp D-500's. One belongs to a Ray Reed who worked on the production line for PL, the other Ed did not know.
 

grapplesaw

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Glen , I was talking to Ed yesterday and there are at least one and possibly two full comp D-500's. One belongs to a Ray Reed who worked on the production line for PL, the other Ed did not know.
Oh well at lease I have one
serial 1002. I believe they started these runs with 1001 but cannot confirm anywhere

 

grapplesaw

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Thanks Lee
What I am finishing off today is replacing broken high heat display diode and sorting out the meter board upgrades I need to do.


So this thing has four systems only found in this unit

1- high frequency common mode distortion null feed back circuit. This is located on the Control board.

2- low impedance cut back circuit. This is located on the meter board. It kicks the system from 120 volt rail to 85 volt rail when lower than 4 ohms is sensed.
I have to check that it has the lasted resistor value as per service Bulletin

3- high power output cut back. It simple cuts rail voltage as above after extended power overload
I need to adjust the resistors in this circuit to higher values due to lower emoter resistors used on the backplane.

4- There is is a built in output relay which operates two ways. The first is same delay on, instant off and doc current protection. It also works with the high heat sensors, which use 110 volt DC power, to turn off speaker output on high heat.

Then i I have to rob some drivers and load them for final testing

I may not use all 18 drivers per side at 120 rail voltage impaired to the 700 which uses 12 drivers at 108 volts. I do think I will ever run below 4 ohms.
Quick math is the MJ21196/95 are good for least 3 amps each at 65 volts.
So 18 times 3 is 54 amps at 65 volts equails 3,500 watts handling power
 
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grapplesaw

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I am working out the last items on my list

One of the things is the protection circuit.. In the following description of Bob's patent for this circuit as used in the series one amp, and it appears to run throughout all the series, the system is described in great detail. The missing factor is what the settings for the protection circuit are set to. Can anyone address this as to fine tuning these amps for different rail voltages, etc. In this 500 i though of adding a variable resistor in place of the 180 ohm base resistors R114 and R126. I believe this was done back in the day for the Kelly Deyong Amps but cannot remember if was for more protection or to milk a little more juice out of them.. I have often wondered if the protection circuit kicking in effects the clipping ..

If anyone has a clear explanation for how this circuit work other than what follows please post it

Glen


From the patent


FIG. 1, is an overall electrical circuit diagram of a direct coupled, dual channel, solid state amplifier, incorporating energy limiting safety circuit portions; and
FIG. 2 is the enlargement of circuit portions serving as energy limiting safety or protection circuit components for one channel, which is part of the overall electrical circuit of the dual channel high fidelity amplifier illustrated in FIG. 1, where two such groups of energy limiting circuit components are illustrated.
DESCRIPTION OF PREFERRED EMBODIMENT Amplifier Circuit Components The high fidelity amplifier 10, illustrated in FIG. 1, with some of its energy limiting protection circuit components illustrated again in FIG. 2, is a direct coupled, solid state, dual channel, class B, linear amplifier capable of producing 700 watts of power, root mean square, when each channel is terminated in}! ohms, complex or resistive. It is capable of producing 350 watts per channel from 0 Hz to 20kI-lz. It may safely operate into any passive load whose complex impedance may range from zero to infinity. The input signal to be amplified is received by the normal, or by the direct coupled input. The signal is transmitted by transistor Q1 to the top of potentiometer R1. The wiper arm of R1 adjusts the amplitude of the signal to be applied to the base of transistor Q2. Transistors Q2 and Q3 form a voltage differential amplifier also consisting of transistors Q4 and Q5. Transistor Q7 is driven by transistor Q4. The collector of transistor 07 may swing the full supply voltage. The output of transistor O7 is applied to the bases of transistor Q8 and Q11 so a complimentary emitter follower action takes place and the output at the emitters of transistors Q8 and Q11 may swing the full voltage supply. Transistor Q6 provides a means of maintaining a stable bias voltage for the output transistors. Diodes D3, D4, and D provide a small for ward voltage at the base of transistor Q6, which causes 'it to turn on and maintain a constant voltage between its emitter and collector terminals regardless of the amount of the collector current. Potentiometer R2 permits a small adjustment of this otherwise constant voltage to be made in order that the output transistors may be rendered conducting on receipt of a signal as small as one pleases.
Feedback voltage taken from the output C of the amplifier is applied to the input differential amplifier having transistors Q2 and Q3. This feedback voltage reduces the overall distortion as measured at the output terminal of the amplifier 10.
The output stage of the amplifier 10 consists of six output transistors, Q14 Q19, two driver transistors, Q12 and Q13, and the two complementary emitter followers transistors Q9 and Q10. As viewed in FIG. 1, the upper output transistors are operated as emitter follower transistors; the lower output transistors are operated as common emitter amplifier transistors. Unity voltage feedback is applied through resistor R3 to the emitter of transistor Q11 so the forward voltage gain assumes a value of one for the combination of transistors O11, O13, Q15, Q17 and Q 19.
Energy Limiting Protection Circuit Components These groups of output transistors in each of the dual channels must be protected and the components of the overall circuit added to provide this protection as shown in FIG. 1 and some as shown in FIG. 2 are the transistors Q9 and Q10, and diodes D6, D7, D8, and D9. They form the active circuit components of the energy limiting protection circuits 12, one for each channel which limit the total energy retained by the output transistors to a safe and pre-determined maximum. These protection circuits 12 are necessary to insure that output transistors will not fail in the event the amplifier overall circuit 10 is accidentally overloaded. The operation of each protection circuit 12, in reference to FIG. 2, where one protection circuit for one channel is illustrated, is as follows. The energy limiter protection circuit 12 develops an output voltage which is an analog representation of the instantaneous silicon chip temperature of the output transistors. When this analog voltage reaches a predetermined threshold, which represents the output device silicon chip temperature and tracks with the energy absorbed, the limiter circuit 12 shunts the drive current around the first driver transistors, thereby preventing the output transistors from experiencing excursions into their unsafe operating region. Current I, which is flowing through resistor R9, develops a voltage across it which is applied to the wiring summing junction A through resistor R8. The time derivative of current I, dI/dt, is generated by utilizing the capacitor C3 and it is made effective also at the wiring summing junction A.
The time integral of I, Idt, is functionally generated by the combination resistor R7 and capacitor C1 and it is made effective also at the summing junction A by resistor R6. Resistor R10 and switching diode D8 form an integrator reset function by discharging capacitor C1 during negative half-cycles of the waveform of the output circuit portions. Resistor R5 provides a voltage, V, at the wiring summing junction A, which is directly proportional to the voltage across the output transistors or the amplifier output. Since the wiring summing junction A is isolated from the integrating capacitor C1 by resistor R6, a portion of this voltage appears at the I junction of resistor R6 and resistor R7 and is integrated by capacitor C1. The value of the total integral is, to a first approximation, the value of Vldt, where the limits of integration are chosen to be over one half cycle of the waveform, or by R7Cl seconds, whichever occurs first. If the half period of the waveform is less than R7Cl seconds, the ongoing integration will be stopped by the reset function. If the half period is longer than R7C1 seconds, the integration is stopped when capacitor Cl becomes fully charged at approximately, R7Cl seconds. The electrical time constant, R7Cl seconds, is chosen to be approximately the same as the thermal time constant of the silicon. chip in each output transistor.
Resistor R4 and capacitor C5 develop a voltage which appears at the wiring summing junction A and is the time derivative, dv/dt, of the output voltage. This causes limiting of the output at extreme dv/dt rates, such as occurs during high frequency clipping. If the value of any of these voltage quantities, or their sum, exceeds the threshold VBE of transistor, Q9, it turns on, and thereby activates diode D6, whose anode is connected to the base of transistor Q8. This overload? ing sensing action shunts the drive current away from transistor Q8, preventing any further increase in energy absorption by the output transistors. Consequently, amplifier 10 having energy limiting circuit components provides as much power as other amplifiers having or requiring three times as many output transistors, when protection is obtained either through use of current limiting or power limiting circuit components.
 

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