How about a capacitor discussion?
- Thread starter Alex SE
- Start date
Consider Panasonic polypropylene films like the ECW-FD series. They'll fit where a WIMA won't, and come with straight or crimped leads. This is the largest value of the series in this package, a 4.75 uF.
I've mounted these on the "wrong" side of board a couple times as getting a electrolytic out of the signal path was the goal.
These have very good reviews for audio use.
I've mounted these on the "wrong" side of board a couple times as getting a electrolytic out of the signal path was the goal.
These have very good reviews for audio use.
Attachments
vince666
Chief Journeyman
J!m
Veteran and General Yakker
I’ve used the Panasonic caps on both the phono pre and the headphone amp. Suggested by Wyn and quite excellent. I did go up on voltage and tighter tolerance on the headphone amp but it was most likely not necessary… and they are quite large.
Alex ANT have recommended those earlier, so quality is not questionable Another one for DIY when architecture of a pcb is not a problem.
Also consider silver mica caps for replacing small value ceramics in the signal path. Very expensive, and larger than the ceramics they replace. Mouser and Digikey carry Cornell Dubilier silver mica, but the voltage values are large, so the caps and leads themselves are large. Physically smaller and lower voltage versions can be found NOS on eBay.
Note the silver mica caps in this awesome preamp. They are the dark brown components. No ceramics are allowed.
https://forums.phxaudiotape.com/threads/preamp-choices.10838/
Note the silver mica caps in this awesome preamp. They are the dark brown components. No ceramics are allowed.
https://forums.phxaudiotape.com/threads/preamp-choices.10838/
vince666
Chief Journeyman
if, at mouser, i select ECWF(D) caps, they still give me two cathegories: "General Film Capacitors" and "RF Microwave Film Capacitors"
so, within the same series, there are two main kinds of caps...
which ones to choose?
I guess the General ones, not the Microwave ones?
You can get much smaller WIMAs than that package...
And MLC capacitors are much better than electrolytic caps in the audio path. The size of MLCCs are much smaller than films. In descending order of quality Mica>Film>MLCC>Electrolytic...
mr_rye89
Veteran and General Yakker
I forgot to post some of the goofy shit in my capacitor collection last night. 10uf Solens are pretty big. I also like to use motor run capacitors in some of my home brew tube gear (because I can!)
Correct, general purpose.
And Joe brings up a great topic about the new to me MLCC ceramics. Very interesting. I've used them on a few kits, and had a few extra I'm going to use as opamp bypass caps. One of those topics I need to research and learn more. Supposedly there is a variety of dielectrics with different properties.
Sometimes you just cannot avoid an electrolytic for C and V reasons but I try to use an alternative whenever humanly possible. Mica, Film and MLCC have no lifetime concerns the way that Electrolytics do, that is a plus.
vince666
Chief Journeyman
Ah yes, maybe going to the MKP2 or MKP0 series, if i remember correctly or also selecting some lower voltage ratings.
Of course, when I had purchased that big 1uF WIMA MKP4 series, I tried to make sure to choose one of the series where they mentioned High Quality Audio use in the specsheet.
Of course, after a few years from that order (it was my first order ever from mouser), I am confident I'll be choosing the stuff a bit better.
Thanks for confirming!
About opamp bypass caps, some Kemet 100nF polyester should do the trick just nicely.
A guy, a while ago at the other place, mentioned these, which have just the right size to be able to easily put them with very short legs at the right op-amp pins:
https://www.mouser.it/ProductDetail/KEMET/MMK5104J63J01L165TA18?qs=LpuuGx8iR2T2b8brVibGLQ==
but there are also these (of same size) if some slightly higher voltage rating is needed:
https://www.mouser.it/ProductDetail/KEMET/MMK5104J100J01L16.5TR18?qs=IKDMbYZLynBNPbu4N6UnvA==
and I am seeing they aren't that different than what Alex/A.N.T put into my own Technics RS-B965 while modifying them, as op-amp supply bypass caps, as you can see at this picture here:
Ah yes, maybe going to the MKP2 or MKP0 series, if i remember correctly or also selecting some lower voltage ratings.
Of course, when I had purchased that big 1uF WIMA MKP4 series, I tried to make sure to choose one of the series where they mentioned High Quality Audio use in the specsheet.
Of course, after a few years from that order (it was my first order ever from mouser), I am confident I'll be choosing the stuff a bit better.
Thanks for confirming!
About opamp bypass caps, some Kemet 100nF polyester should do the trick just nicely.
A guy, a while ago at the other place, mentioned these, which have just the right size to be able to easily put them with very short legs at the right op-amp pins:
https://www.mouser.it/ProductDetail/KEMET/MMK5104J63J01L165TA18?qs=LpuuGx8iR2T2b8brVibGLQ==
but there are also these (of same size) if some slightly higher voltage rating is needed:
https://www.mouser.it/ProductDetail/KEMET/MMK5104J100J01L16.5TR18?qs=IKDMbYZLynBNPbu4N6UnvA==
and I am seeing they aren't that different than what Alex/A.N.T put into my own Technics RS-B965 while modifying them, as op-amp supply bypass caps, as you can see at this picture here:
View attachment 74554
Somebody told me a long time ago, I'm not 100% sure but I think it was MICA, is best in a place of 1st cap in signal path, directly after a head. I believe a person said that Nakamichi is doing so (not sure about that either.
Regarding Wima, there was discussion about which of them are best for what, MKP2, 3... your experiences with them would be appreciated, specially if you have compred them practically.
Vince, I just love those grey caps. Why? There is nothing special with them. The one can use whichever premium brand as they will act the same. Not att all complicated as electrolitic caps are.
Regarding Wima, there was discussion about which of them are best for what, MKP2, 3... your experiences with them would be appreciated, specially if you have compred them practically.
Vince, I just love those grey caps. Why? There is nothing special with them. The one can use whichever premium brand as they will act the same. Not att all complicated as electrolitic caps are.
mlucitt
Veteran and General Yakker
I just checked the price on Wima (my choice) Polypropylene 1uF 63V 10% capacitors. These are the MKP2 Series. They are not available at Mouser, you can get them at DigiKey. The price is $2.21 each and the first quantity discount is for 100 and then the price only drops to $2.118 each.
The same value Wima capacitor in Polyester (MKS2) is $0.448 at DigiKey but you have to buy a minimum of 10. The quantity discount for 101 is $0.43 each.
The same value Wima capacitor in Polyester (MKS2) is $0.63 at Mouser. The quantity discount is for 100 and then the price drops to $.348 each.
Referring to some earlier posts, the only "High Voltage" capacitors on the WOA Rev G1 Control Board are C14L, C14R and C15L, C15R. These are 4.uF 160V capacitors on the unfused rail voltage supplies. There are no capacitors in the audio path to worry about. And I see no need for a 250V rated capacitor anywhere in an audio amplifier, they are just too big. The exception are the Mica capacitors - they have a naturally high voltage rating while staying very small.
I am not going to even mention the ceramic capacitors. The Multi-Layer Ceramic Capacitors (MLCC) are a whole different story. However, I see no use for them when a fine film capacitor will perform as good or better.
The same value Wima capacitor in Polyester (MKS2) is $0.448 at DigiKey but you have to buy a minimum of 10. The quantity discount for 101 is $0.43 each.
The same value Wima capacitor in Polyester (MKS2) is $0.63 at Mouser. The quantity discount is for 100 and then the price drops to $.348 each.
Referring to some earlier posts, the only "High Voltage" capacitors on the WOA Rev G1 Control Board are C14L, C14R and C15L, C15R. These are 4.uF 160V capacitors on the unfused rail voltage supplies. There are no capacitors in the audio path to worry about. And I see no need for a 250V rated capacitor anywhere in an audio amplifier, they are just too big. The exception are the Mica capacitors - they have a naturally high voltage rating while staying very small.
I am not going to even mention the ceramic capacitors. The Multi-Layer Ceramic Capacitors (MLCC) are a whole different story. However, I see no use for them when a fine film capacitor will perform as good or better.
vince666
Chief Journeyman
actually, i've bought a few of those big 1uF WIMA but i still never tried them!
Regarding some good ones, don't know if as coupling caps (their capacitance values are way too low for that) but surely as loading caps (parallel between head's signal and ground) or into EQ networks, where you can be OK with capacitance values in the hundreds of pF or a few nF, a very very good choice would be the polystirene ones... but they need special attention while soldering them.
The WIMA MKP is the preferred series whenever possible. They used to have a yellow series which were polystyrene but those have been discontinued.
Only resort to the MLCC caps where Mica and Film are a no go. MLCC is far better than Electrolytics for audio path tasks