700B blew one Right channel 5A supply fuse

NavLinear

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Yes. With fuses in the bulb is bright - probably about 75% of what it's capable of. In case it's relevant, as previously mentioned, the panel lamps are quite dim with the fuses in place but with fuses out, are somewhat brighter.

Old Q8 and Q9 had insulating discs underneath them which I used for the new ones. Q3, Q5, Q10 and Q11 had no such discs so I mounted them flush with the board.

By "electrically isolated" do you mean a continuity check from transistor housing to chassis ground with the amp powered off or some other method with the amp power on?

Thinking continuity and with amp off, I tried that with this DMM I'm not yet familiar with. I can make it produce an audible tone when continuity is present. Placing black meter lead to chassis ground and red lead to transistor case, I checked all of the TO-3 transistors. The result was, I thought, unusual.

Hard for me to explain and may not mean anything, but;

The chassis ground point I chose for the black meter lead was one of the screws holding a right channel output transistor to the heat sink. Touching the case of all TO-3 transistors produced no sound except Q10 on the right channel. I switched ground points to a transformer mounting bolt and repeated the process, but this time, no sound was produced by touching any TO-3.

The tone you hear can be short in duration or continuous - if continuous that may be a problem but if it is short in nature that may not be a problem. What readings are you seeing?

Switching back to the first ground point, I repeated once more and again heard the tone touching T10.

I moved the black lead to an output transistor screw on the other channel and the sound was made by that channel's Q10.

Sound was only made using a ground screw in one row of transistors in each channel, not the other. Or, anywhere else.
It seems you've measured the collector to ground - although you may want to pick a different location for your ground point. I would go directly to the chassis if possible or the star ground point is another good choice. With the four output fuses removed you can take a reading between the TO-3 case and the chassis to verify if one is shorted. If the insulator is dicked up you will see a low ohm value - otherwise it should be open or a very high reading.
 
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62vauxhall

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Not sure exactly where a/the star ground point is, I used a sheet metal screw into the chassis for a ground point. With black meter lead to that and red to the TO-3 cases the meter displayed "OL" for all so no shorts are present.
 

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Not sure exactly where a/the star ground point is, I used a sheet metal screw into the chassis for a ground point. With black meter lead to that and red to the TO-3 cases the meter displayed "OL" for all so no shorts are present.
By "star ground" he means the copper buss bar that is between the large filter caps. It's the ground reference for the entire amp.

I may have mis-read, but it sounds like you were using one of the output devices mounting screws as your reference. These are at the collector of the output devices- not reference ground. They will show roughly rail voltage when powered on. Be careful not to touch them when the amp is powered. They bite!
 

62vauxhall

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By "star ground" he means the copper buss bar that is between the large filter caps. It's the ground reference for the entire amp.

I may have mis-read, but it sounds like you were using one of the output devices mounting screws as your reference. These are at the collector of the output devices- not reference ground. They will show roughly rail voltage when powered on. Be careful not to touch them when the amp is powered. They bite!
You read correctly, I was using a transistor mounting screw, only because it was bare metal, nearby and something I could get an alligator clip onto. I suspected the buss bar as star ground but was not sure. The metal screw into the chassis should have performed the same function.
 

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Depending on how the amp was wired, maybe not. To be sure use the star ground. Still have just one row of outputs in?
 

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Yes, just one row of outputs in, the 410's.

Re-checked the TO-3 transistor cases using star ground on buss bar, line fuses out and power off. Meter reading was "OL" for all.
 
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62vauxhall

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I put the fuses in and got, as you called them before, funky readings. Except for Q7 which went almost immediately to 5.9 Meg Ohms and stayed there.

The other transistors on both sides displayed numbers (some in Meg Ohms, some in K Ohms) that rose and/or fell usually slowly.
 

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No, you probably were clear but I can't differentiate transistor styles.

Hopefully you're saying to measure 410 cases to buss bar.

With the amp top side up and me facing the front, the large caps are on the left. I'll call the 410 nearest the caps #1, and going left to right the next as # 2 etc.

With black test lead on the buss bar and red touching the cases:
410 #1 is pretty much a steady 7.3 Meg ohms
410 #2 seems to start at 40 K Ohms and climb slowly to 140.6 K Ohms
410 #3 is pretty much steady at 6.4 Meg Ohms
410 #4 seems to start at 20 K Ohms , climb slowly to about 158 K Ohms then drops slowly to 142.7 K Ohms.
 

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The collector is effectively isolated from ground then.

Put your leads accross the speaker posts and check for DC offset. Don't leave it on any longer than to get the reading. We are looking for DC volts...
 

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With dim bulb tester in place:

Left channel minus .5V and climbs slowly. Did not leave amp on long enough to see where it might stop. Pulled the plug after 20 seconds or so @ minus .65 volts.
Right channel minus 23 volts.
 

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Sounds like Q7 is wounded on the right channel. But could be Q1-Q4 also. Check those first. In circuit will be fine for now and write the mm easements down.
 

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That was a bit challenging, even though I only did the Right channel. Hope these are accurate. There might be a problem with Q3 since I got a voltage reading where I think none should be. I checked it three times with the same result. As for the others, please advise if you think I should re-check any.

Q7
.60 volts - red to B & black to E
.55 volts - red to B & black to C
OL - red to E & black to B
OL - red to C & black to B
.45 volts - red to C & black to E
.45 volts red to E & black to C

Q3
.65 volts - red to B & black to E
.60 volts - red to E & black to C
OL - red to E & black to B
OL - red to C & black to B
OL - red to C & black to E
.75 volts - red to E & black to C <<<< shouldn't this be OL?<shouldn't this="" be="" ol?

</shouldn't>

Q4
.59 volts - red to B & black to E
.61 volts - red to B & black to C
OL - red to E & black to B
OL - red to C & black to B
OL - red to E & black to C
OL - red to C & black to E

Q1
OL - red to B & black to E
OL - red to B & black to C
.65 volts - red to E & black to B
.66 - red to C & black to B
00 - red to C & black to E
00 - red to E & black to C

Q2
OL - red to B & black to E
OL - red to B & black to C
.66 volts - red to E & black to B
.66 - red to C & black to B
OL - red to E & black to C
OL - red to C & black to E
 
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Zach C.

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.75 volts - red to E & black to C <<<< shouldn't this be OL?<shouldn't this="" be="" ol?

</shouldn't>
Measured out of circuit, this is definitely true. In circuit, you may be forward biasing another semiconductor without knowing it.

I haven't followed closely to know which board you've got...even then, it's easy to miss this kind of thing if you're unfamiliar with the circuit.

I would first compare to the known good channel. If different, I would pull the "bad" Q3 from the circuit and re-test, since other failed components on the board can lead to unexpected readings beyond what I mentioned above. IOW, it can test bad in circuit when it should test good in circuit due to other failed parts.
 

62vauxhall

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Measured out of circuit, this is definitely true. In circuit, you may be forward biasing another semiconductor without knowing it.

I haven't followed closely to know which board you've got...even then, it's easy to miss this kind of thing if you're unfamiliar with the circuit.

I would first compare to the known good channel. If different, I would pull the "bad" Q3 from the circuit and re-test, since other failed components on the board can lead to unexpected readings beyond what I mentioned above. IOW, it can test bad in circuit when it should test good in circuit due to other failed parts.
Q3 in Left channel still in circuit:

00 - red to B & black to E
OL - red to B & black to C
00 - red to E & black to B
.66 volts - red to C & black to B
.66 volts - red to C & black to E
.66 volts - red to E & black to C
 

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Q3 in Left channel still in circuit:

00 - red to B & black to E
OL - red to B & black to C
00 - red to E & black to B
.66 volts - red to C & black to B
.66 volts - red to C & black to E
.66 volts - red to E & black to C
Assuming an orientation problem with the BCE in your testing, I think you have the same pattern here- three conducting, three blocking in both channels.

If right, that implies that the reading that was troubling you should be correct. Unfortunately, I haven't messed with enough of these to just "know" if that's what you should read for this specific circuit.

Sorry.

Which board did you decide you have?
 

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Gary, anytime there is a reading of .00 accross any semiconductor jct that is a redflag. Pull Q1 and check out of circuit. It should never read short between any n2 test points, same with Q3, but we're gonna go one at a time here...
 

62vauxhall

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Assuming an orientation problem with the BCE in your testing, I think you have the same pattern here- three conducting, three blocking in both channels.

If right, that implies that the reading that was troubling you should be correct. Unfortunately, I haven't messed with enough of these to just "know" if that's what you should read for this specific circuit.

Sorry.

Which board did you decide you have?
The board is 14A.

Regarding orientation. Viewing the PC board from the bottom, I followed this diagram to identify which connections are BASE - EMITTER - COLLECTOR.
Transistor printout pattern.jpg
 

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laatsch55

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WHOA!!! Way to generic to apply to all tranny connections. When posting that Gary, please state what tranny you're talking about and in what position...
 
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