The Unofficial Phoenix Open Reel Tape Thread

[Elite-ist]

Whereas with the cassette format I have been recently dialing down my peak recording input levels to 0 dB to +2 dB for just about all tape formulations, the same cannot be said of open-reel tape. With Maxell XL1 I can record to momentary peaks of +3 dB, Quantegy 480 even higher to +4 dB. There is less chance of saturation with 1/4" open-reel tape travelling at 7 1/2 i.p.s. while recording to these limits. The needles on the RT-707 are very sensitive, as most of you, owning them, have probably found.

Let us know what you find in your recording sessions on how far you can safely push the tape and at what recording speed.

Nando.

 

[nobody]

Will do, so far just testing out at 7.5 ips and hitting right at 0 db, and everything sounds really nice, full and rich. I'm a bit of a bass head so the deep sound out of this is right up my alley. I'm not too concerned about pushing more onto the tape as at least on cassettes I honestly have never really seen what you gain coming close to overload. If I'm missing anything, let me know. I do want to give things more of a shot at low speed because I'm planning a giant mix of 10" 3600 tape at slow speed to last me a nice long evening or afternoon of music.

Oh, and whoever recorded these used tapes I picked up in a local shop did an excellent job (going a bit over 0, up to around +3 in spots on Maxell UD 35-90) so maybe I need to rethink that. It's all stuff off the radio, mostly from the Hearts of Space radio show in the 80s. I would not have expected recordings off the radio to sound so good. Come to think of it, that tape from Nick was recorded similarly higher than I have been going with as well and also sounded great so maybe I really do need to think about boosting the levels a bit.

 

[BubbaH]

Pioneer tied their meters to their output. Sometimes tapes made on Pioneers show really high levels played back on a Teac. I used to have that problem playing back tapes made on my 1011 on my X10R.

I have not used any Quantegy tape, but had my share of experiences with old Ampex tape. That said, Maxell is some of the finest reel tape I have used. LPR35 is also pretty darn good in my books. I have only used 1 roll of LPR though, and did not have any bad experiences with it as some claim. I ordered the pancake in 08 thereabouts.

 

[Elite-ist]

Dave: I have picked up a number of used reels, mostly 7" with mixes already recorded on them. I had thoughts of re-recording over them, but I found most of them were well-recorded with music I like on them. However, a few of the used 10.5" reels I bought had mixes on them that were either badly recorded or weren't up my alley for songs I would enjoy. I believe I have one that had aquatic mammals, various birds, singing, squawking or squeaking. Not my idea of a peaceful way of relaxing before bed-time.

Nando.

 

[nobody]

I'm not entirely sure that I'd never play that sound effects tape.


Also, been playing around a bit more and learning some lessons.

Lesson 1 - With used reels you never know what exactly is on the reel. Box was a Maxell UD 35-50, and the 7" plastic reel had Maxell etched into it. Yet, it played long enough (90 minutes on 3.75 ips) that I'm pretty sure it is 1800 ft as opposed to the 1200 ft shown on the box. Makes me hesitant to make any judgements about what the tape is like as I really have no idea what tape is actually spooled on there. Only cost a couple bucks so not a big deal or anything, but this makes me think being cautious with used tapes and not paying a ton for something on a reel that you really can't absolutely identify anyway is probably good policy. The tape sounds good, not really complaining about that. But, had I paid some of the high prices on Ebay for a specific tape and then the spool arrived with something else on it?

Lesson 2 - Speed matters. Now, with this mystery tape I got quite nice sound recording at 3.75 ips. However, turning the speed up to 7.5 ips EVERYTHING improved. Lower noise, deeper more detailed bass; every aspect was at least slightly better. Now, will I always record at the higher speeds? Nope. I will absolutely use the lower speed settings to make some long running tapes for background music and party mixes I don't have to change after having a few. The lower speed can still make some nice recordings that in many aspects surpass cassettes that I listen to happily anyway so I'm quite happy to play lower speed tapes on this thing. But, when top quality is wanted, cranking the speed reaps rewards. I think the reduction in noise was the most surprising aspect of this to me.

I'm still trying to settle on exactly what levels I want to use to record, but I can see that reel tape seems to be able to hold a pretty strong signal. Not sure if I get any sound improvement or not recording slightly higher than I would instinctively go for. By instinct, I would just lean toward keeping the VU meters out of the red for all but the biggest peaks, which on my deck means below 0. I feel like I can go a bit higher than that without distorting noticeably, but not sure if there is a good reason why I should. The lack of dolby does mean that I can get a more silent recording on cassette. However, that's the only thing that cassette wins. The fullness of sound, coupled with great, smooth detail on this reel machine beats cassettes across the board from my initial assessments. I may be getting hooked.

As someone new to tape, any lessons those of you who've been at this a while have learned would be nice to hear as well. And feel free to point out anything I say that seems amiss.

 

[laatsch55]

And then there's 15 IPS....

 

[orange]

I'm working on hopefully gaining another Teac A-2340 this summer. 4 channel is definitely for me. God forbid I ever find an 8 track Tascam I can afford...

 

[nobody]

And then there's 15 IPS....

Not on my deck. I'd have to imagine those higher speeds sound great, but man that would eat up some tape.

 

[8991XJ]

Lesson 1 - With used reels you never know what exactly is on the reel. Box was a Maxell UD 35-50, and the 7" plastic reel had Maxell etched into it. Yet, it played long enough (90 minutes on 3.75 ips) that I'm pretty sure it is 1800 ft as opposed to the 1200 ft shown on the box.

Maxell leader markings can indicate what the tape is provided it is a Maxell tape.

 

[nobody]

Yeah, pretty sure the tape is still MAxell, just the 1800 instead of the 1200. But I don't know the various leader designs at this point so I'll have to start learning those.

 

[nobody]

Lesson 3 - Only use real splicing tape. I've read many times to only use real splicing tape and I never intended not to. However, I ran across a big box of old tapes for next to nothing and figured I would have fun playing around with them, and I have. Some old Richard Pryor stuff recorded on one, a self hypnotism tape, a couple old swing era tapes, some Patsy Cline, and a couple good oldies mixes. And a few decent tapes that I'll use as blanks. But, while some of it was in fine shape, other reels had seen better days and there were a couple that had obviously been spliced together with plain ol' scotch tape, which had proceeded to get gummy and leak onto the other layers of the reel, causing the splices to break apart and basically turning the entire reel to trash. So yeah, maybe for the short term it looks relatively harmless, but give it a few years and you could well end up with a big mess using something other than splicing tape.

 

[Nick Danger]

Maxell Open Reel Tape Link

Dave, I thought this might be of some use to ya:

Maxell

 

[nobody]

Yup, been scouring things over there for bits and pieces about tape. Grabbed a couple reels of Maxell stuff so far. Seems like it is a safe tape choice. But so far, I think the tape that I'm most digging is that Quantegy/Ampex 456. The Maxells tuff may be more accurate actually, but the 456 just sounds really thick and good. I'm thinking I need to work up a nice reggae mix on some of this. You like bass?

 

[laatsch55]

Do we breathe air??

 

[Nick Danger]

Yup, been scouring things over there for bits and pieces about tape. Grabbed a couple reels of Maxell stuff so far. Seems like it is a safe tape choice. But so far, I think the tape that I'm most digging is that Quantegy/Ampex 456. The Maxells tuff may be more accurate actually, but the 456 just sounds really thick and good. I'm thinking I need to work up a nice reggae mix on some of this. You like bass?

Oh yeah, me likey da Bass.

 

[nobody]

Good to know. Gonna hafta get busy soon.

 

[Skywavebe]

Open reel tape should not be feared or worried about. The reason is that two companies are still producing fresh tape and according to Don Morris who I talk with from time to time sales are not going down.
Older tape- forget baking. It is not cost effective and is not permanent.
Nu finish is the final solution. If it does not work and not all tape has the same symptoms. I had a Ampex 478 tape that there was nothing that helped it- it continued to look oily even after cleaning with alcohol- scrap it and put LPR35 on the reel.
I have processed Scotch Classic, 807,406, 456 and even a 1/2" tape and 1" tapes so far as well as a few alignment tapes. They all were successful but I am working on a chemical that you just apply and no cleaning is required. In my spare time.

Places to get fresh tape-
Splicit, Full Compass, US Recording Media and I am sure there are at least 5 or 6 more.

LPR35 is the only new fresh 1.0 mil tape tape made- I have tested it many times. It is the best tape made to date for that thickness.
It prints 1 dB higher than Maxell XL I which was the last standard.

If you are pro- you will want RMGI SM911, SM900 or ATR Master. ATR is the only USA made tape and the best tape to date- it is a +10.5dB tape, SM900 is a +9dB and SM911 is a +6dB tape.

All this for those that do not know this already. Most machines made 30 or more years ago are designed with setting for those tapes and will do much better if modified for the better tapes. Some machines just need calibration. None of them are set up for the tapes of today as they stand.

 

[El Magnifico]

Some of my Tapes...

Here You can see the best records and open reel tape storage for the money: IKEA's. I bought this one because my storage places were full and my wife got tired of seeing tapes and records all around the house,so, I got this plus I installed wheels. All for hardly $100.00 ! I have Maxell, TDK, Ampex 456 and BASF 911. The domestic versions tends to "age" better than the professional formulas. It has less oxide particles and I can re-record very old tapes without an issue. Not so with the "pro" formulas. The dirt left on the heads is so intensive that becomes almost impossible to re-record on them!