Greetings from upstate NY - have owned the same Dual 500 the past 4 decades...

Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#61
I knew you'd like it.

Good to meet you too. I like Jeff Beck's music - thanks for sharing this clip. I had not seen it before.
She does have a killer smile tho...
Nav, seems like the theme of this evening is the 'daily double'. If you like the idea of a classically trained lady musician who can take something as raw & abrasive as a Sepultura song & almost turn it into a piece of classical music...but at the same time is able to make a crowd of Icelandic headbangers go wild at the finish...then here is quick little 3-minute ditty worth watching. ...Oh yeah, almost forgot, her name is Vika, and she has a memorable smile at the end.

****

Isn't it amazing to observe (& experience) the power that music has over humans? Wild stuff!
 
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#62
Agree ... and this one has been fun!
e30m3mon, you are so right, this has been especially fun for me. You know, this forum has the same vibe that I felt whenever we were at the track and you were surrounded by like-minded individuals who were also taking what they had put together and were going to put the sum total of their efforts to the test. I read elsewhere that you were an instructor driver on a track in CT?

Years ago I went to a Ducati Day at NH Motor Speedway, where you alternated ~45 minute classroom theory sessions & 45 minute on track practice time all day long. Man, the instructors were so observant & helpful, my last laps of the day were so much quicker but at the same time felt so much slower -- the difference between untrained reacting moment to moment to what's right in front of me...to having a plan/groove and looking through the turns, etc, made all the difference in the world. I had a Sport 750 at the time, and that day was by far the best day I ever spent on that bike.

I also used to go to the Epping dragstrip on a semi-regular basis, primarily the Wed. night test & tune. That was the place that felt closest to the vibe in this forum -- everybody there were more than happy to share whatever knowledge they had picked up along the way.

****

Anyway, thanks to Nav's earlier value-added to this thread this evening has turned into a musical ladies night. I'm sharing this final musical choice of the evening w/you because you of all people comprehend how important it is to get deep into proper timing (aka the groove) when traversing different sections of the track! And the reason why I'm all amped up (pun intended) to be listening to this song is because when this lady plays the bass the lights in the house dim in time with her thunder thumb.

It's as if I have been training at your track in a stock 36hp VW beetle for the past 20+ years, and now I readying a (similar curb weight) 360+hp
2-seater Cobra replica. How can a 10x better power/weight ratio not make for a better, more awe-inspiring track day? When it comes to this song by Meshell Ndegeocello , underpowered listening is about as much fun as a stock aircooled VW bug at the dragstrip.

In English, can't wait to hear/feel this song post WOPL upgrade!

NOTE: For best results, turn it up - Enjoy!
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#63
NOTE: The following are quick-n-dirty photos documenting the unearthing day. I am hoping to take some better quality photos when I'm actually working on the amps. (Steampunking the wiring harness, etc.)

In English, it was starting to snow, so no time for the artsy stuff... :0)

In this first photo, this is the amp I've owned since new. (purchased ~43 years ago.) Note that it is labeled " Dual 500 ". (Serial # 1671)
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#64
Here is amp #2, which I bought for a very fair price right around the '90-'91 timeframe. I was so busy with my life going sideways at the time that I simply left it in the box after making sure that it had survived the shipment from the owner in Ft. Worth to me in central VT. (at the time)

I've yet to fully unbox the thing, so the serial number info will be shared soon. NOTE: This amp is labeled " D - 500 ". (You know, elsewhere I was making a mountain out of a molehill about this mismatch (wanting the amps to be exact twins visually) ...but now I'm starting to think that this is a feature, not a fault, since I actually own a Dual turntable. And besides, only the most eagle-eyed audiophiles will notice it...normal, well-adjusted folks won't even see it. (I'm going to use it as a subtle litmus-test in the listening room someday. :0)

For the purposes of documenting all this re-work, from this point forward I'll refer to them simply as 'D500', amp #1 or amp #2.

OK, here's amp #2:
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#65
Here's my Dual 606, also bought new, equipped with the Shure V15 Type IV cartridge.

According to the following article, if I go through it & undo the effects of the passage of time on the internals,
it should get me by:

https://www.hifinews.com/content/dual-cs-606-turntable

It will be interesting to see what it looks like after the saran wrap is removed...

Bonus points: If I can locate my old Dual 1019, I would put a serious effort into restoring that one to better than new condition. (I would justify that just because it gave me so many hours of pleasure way back when.)

Dropping the needle on either the live ELP or Yessongs vinyl back in the day while wearing those Stanton Dynaphase 60s...such good memories!

PS: I realize that the Dual turntables were/are considered Mid-Fi at best...and of course given my mechanical background I'd love to possess an older exotic turntable that pushed the performance envelope...just like I wish I also had a mahogany speedboat to pour the rest of my savings into...but, alas we simply don't get to have it all. But I'll be OK.

Besides, the turntable will be used primarily for nostalgic occasions, like when it's time to have friends over & listen to some live Jimi Hendrix's Band Of Gypsies while enjoying some tasty/spicy mexican food...just like we used to do... :0)
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#66
Once upon a time I used to consider myself a better than average 'scope dope.' Of course it was easy to get a good stable display on the Tektronix 465/475 o-scopes, they would trigger on just about anything with more amplitude than the width of the line trace itself.

I know others who I used to work with that preferred their favorite model B&K, Philips, HP Agilent, etc., over the Tek, and trying to convert them was like trying to change their religion. :0) Seriously, I think a lot of it has to do with what you were raised on as an apprentice. Even so, the Tek scopes just seemed so easy to get it to trigger, even when you were working with messy signals.

Now? I hope that this is like riding a bicycle, for I feel like it's gonna be 'dope on a scope' time. Got a lot of rust to bust off of these skills.

So here's my old faithful troubleshooting companion. As a precaution, it's been in storage so long that I'm going to replace the old caps before attempting to use it in anger. Feels like I'm trying to boot Windows Vista on a barely big-enough computer - gonna take some time to get this project off the ground. :0)
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#67
The Variac. Looked like it had only been driven to church on Sundays by a little old lady when I bought if off of eBay for a fair price. Haven't gotten to use it in anger yet, but that is about to change.

HINT: It's down on the floor behind the driver's seat.
 

Attachments

Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#68
Eventually this pair of Infinity QLS-1 loudspeakers will be the highly reactive, complex dummy load for the restored D500 amps. I am going to need to go through the crossovers & renew/upgrade all the capacitors in them. They really deserve a complete, careful restoration before being placed back in service. But if I can get them to sound as good as they did in the late 20th century it will be well worth the effort spent on them.

For now, they have to remain in storage. Someday...
 

Attachments

NavLinear

Veteran and General Yakker
Joined
Apr 12, 2012
Messages
5,841
Location
SoCal
Tagline
Happy New Year Phoenix-Lurkers and all others
#71
Yeah, I came in under the radar. Never got a NAV welcome. Don't get me wrong, I ain't complaining. Been here long enough to see many of NAV's postings and I damn sure like em.
Well sheeeeit - here's a long delayed Nav welcome babe!
0001-11_1200.jpg 0001-13_1800.jpg
 
Joined
Nov 3, 2021
Messages
375
Location
Houston Texas
Tagline
Play the Game, don’t be the Game
#74
That’s going to be a very nice system again when your done with the restoration. I think it is awesome that you will be able to compare it to when you bought it all new back in the day. Having never owned any of my vintage gear when it was new, I always wonder “ if it sounds this good today, did it sound even better when it was new?”. For some things I think the answer is no, it sounds just like it did when new but for others, especially speakers I will never know.
Looking forward to watching your projects.
 
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#75
Well sheeeeit - here's a long delayed Nav welcome babe!
View attachment 58319 View attachment 58320
Q1: Does she like to solder? Or equate the smell of a smoking soldering iron in the morning...with the smell of victory?

Q2: Will she drop everything at a moment's notice in order to go take in some live music? Eyes widen just a tiny bit if you mention that it's a Blues festival?

****

If so, then given her good taste in boots I think we have a Trifecta here.

****

When you get to this late stage of the ride atop the little blue marble, you gotta keep your priorities straight...

:0)

PS - Thanks for sharing the official Phoenix welcome in this thread -- Cheers!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#76
Welcome to a great place to make new friends. We may have lots to talk about. Lots of developments in building 500’s since that thread was written Look forward to talking someday.
Sir, just as soon as I finish a little more background reading, the amps are home & I'm getting ready to run them through the amplifier Phase Dock I'm piecing together.

I am looking forward to you helping me spend my money for maximum effect. (This is what I've been saving up for! :0)

This is going to be fun -- I've been looking forward to this for the last 1/2 of my career. Whoooo doggie!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
305
Location
near Liverpool, NY
Tagline
Lifelong student / listening = bliss
#77
That’s going to be a very nice system again when your done with the restoration. I think it is awesome that you will be able to compare it to when you bought it all new back in the day. Having never owned any of my vintage gear when it was new, I always wonder “ if it sounds this good today, did it sound even better when it was new?”. For some things I think the answer is no, it sounds just like it did when new but for others, especially speakers I will never know.
Looking forward to watching your projects.
NeverSatisfied, thanks for the words of encouragement! You know, looking at the big picture of how the audio hobby has changed over the past 40 years, I am particularly interested in solving a couple of today's problems that Bob Carver (or anybody else back then) didn't know were lurking way over the horizon in the future.

One problem is the sheer amount of RFI in today's world, (Radio Frequency Interference) thanks in part to the race to the bottom with cheap wall warts, light dimmers, noisy solar panels, and the like. Check this out, back in the day some coding guru, using precise timing loops to stimulate digital address & data lines at musical note rates, turned a computer room 12-bit computer (DEC PDP-8) into a RFI music box that could be listened to with a handheld AM radio. (Note: I think the original coder did it just for the personal challenge, but the program had earned word-of-mouth status in the community, & running this program as a demo for why my students should learn more about our company's Tempest offerings was very persuasive.)

In English, just because in the mostly all analog households in the '70s Bob Carver didn't have to worry about the hurricane of RFI surrounding us today (both radiated over the air + the stuff injected into the power mains) ...doesn't mean that I don't have to. Part of the reason I can justify in my mind the use of the 200Mhz Tek 475 o-scope is that I'm going to do my very best to clean up the incoming power & pay attention to whatever shielding I can implement along the way. (I've actually budgeted as long as it takes to ensure real cleanliness in this area.)

****

Of course there are those that would argue that a vintage quasi-complementary Class B consumer amp isn't worth this level of RFI sleuthing.

But Grapplesaw & others have already convinced me to convert/upgrade to a fully-complementary output stage, and I am also going to spend some quality time (down the road, post WOPLing) trying to figure out if the Blomley circuitry can mitigate the remaining Class B notch distortion.

In other words, I am going to pay close attention to the original noise floor AND at the same time defend against today's RFI environment so that all the other distortion-mitigating upgrades will remain audible. (by their absence. :0)

PS - I originally got interested in this RFI stuff because back in the day I would (try to) take a nice-sounding consumer-grade AM/FM receiver from home & into the (commercial) raised-floor computer lab where I was spending so much time...and it was unlistenable due to all the hash! (And it wasn't until much later when I was working with airborne radar systems that I saw what they did to keep the RFI gremlins at bay.) But that's what retirement is all about -- I'm going to go full-on Don Quixote at the RFI windmills I've described above. ;0)

If you haven't already followed the computer RFI music box link above, please do so. (Best part of demo = 3:00 on) Then you can better understand my focus in this area. Enjoy!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 3, 2021
Messages
375
Location
Houston Texas
Tagline
Play the Game, don’t be the Game
#79
NeverSatisfied, thanks for the words of encouragement! You know, looking at the big picture of how the audio hobby has changed over the past 40 years, I am particularly interested in solving a couple of today's problems that Bob Carver (or anybody else back then) didn't know were lurking way over the horizon in the future.

One problem is the sheer amount of RFI in today's world, (Radio Frequency Interference) thanks in part to the race to the bottom with cheap wall warts, light dimmers, noisy solar panels, and the like. Check this out, back in the day some coding guru, using precise timing loops to stimulate digital address & data lines at musical note rates, turned a computer room 12-bit computer (DEC PDP-8) into a RFI music box that could be listened to with a handheld AM radio. (Note: I think the original coder did it just for the personal challenge, but the program had earned word-of-mouth status in the community, & running this program as a demo for why my students should learn more about our company's Tempest offerings was very persuasive.)

In English, just because in the mostly all analog households in the '70s Bob Carver didn't have to worry about the hurricane of RFI surrounding us today (both radiated over the air + the stuff injected into the power mains) ...doesn't mean that I don't have to. Part of the reason I can justify in my mind the use of the 200Mhz Tek 475 o-scope is that I'm going to do my very best to clean up the incoming power & pay attention to whatever shielding I can implement along the way. (I've actually budgeted as long as it takes to ensure real cleanliness in this area.)

****

Of course there are those that would argue that a vintage quasi-complementary Class B consumer amp isn't worth this level of RFI sleuthing.

But Grapplesaw & others have already convinced me to convert/upgrade to a fully-complementary output stage, and I am also going to spend some quality time (down the road, post WOPLing) trying to figure out if the Blomley circuitry can mitigate the remaining Class B notch distortion.

In other words, I am going to pay close attention to the original noise floor AND at the same time defend against today's RFI environment so that all the other distortion-mitigating upgrades will remain audible. (by their absence. :0)

PS - I originally got interested in this RFI stuff because back in the day I would (try to) take a nice-sounding consumer-grade AM/FM receiver from home & into the raised-floor computer lab where I was spending so much time...and it was unlistenable due to all the hash! (And it wasn't until much later when I was working with airborne radar systems that I saw what they did to keep the RFI gremlins at bay.) But that's what retirement is all about -- I'm going to go full-on Don Quixote at the RFI windmills I've described above. ;0)

If you haven't already followed the computer RFI music box link above, please do so. (Best part of demo = 3:00 on) Then you can better understand my focus in this area. Enjoy!
Very interesting read, thanks.
 

laatsch55

Administrator,
Staff member
Joined
Jan 14, 2011
Messages
68,746
Location
Gillette, Wyo.
Tagline
Halfbiass...Electron Herder and Backass Woof
#80
Nav, seems like the theme of this evening is the 'daily double'. If you like the idea of a classically trained lady musician who can take something as raw & abrasive as a Sepultura song & almost turn it into a piece of classical music...but at the same time is able to make a crowd of Icelandic headbangers go wild at the finish...then here is quick little 3-minute ditty worth watching. ...Oh yeah, almost forgot, her name is Vika, and she has a memorable smile at the end.

****

Isn't it amazing to observe (& experience) the power that music has over humans? Wild stuff!


A very, shall we say "intimate" setting for the musicians!! She gave that Roland hell eh??
 
Top