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Thread: Op amp myths and........

  1. #1
    Forum Veteran WOPL Sniffer's Avatar
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    Screw it

    Op amp myths and........

    Interesting read (short) on Op-Amps.

    http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/08/...facts.html?m=1
    I had the nations problems figured out one night while on blah blah blah........ huh?

    Big amps
    Kenner Close N Play

  2. #2
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    Halfbiass...Electron Herder and Backass Woof
    Agreed Perry, good read.
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  3. #3
    Forum Veteran 8991XJ's Avatar
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    maybe i can revisit that but he said the opa2134 will sound the same as an ne5532 and will I swapped an opa into an ne spot and the player sounds much better. Didn't care for it before, not it is fine. Some folks just don't hear the same. Or maybe it was my desire to reaffirm the expenditure of that 3 bucks. wtf why do folks insist on what others can hear. Those guys need glasses for their ears to hear the differences some hear.
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  4. #4
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    Halfbiass...Electron Herder and Backass Woof
    Very subjective subject, this audio business.......
    taking something that's already good, and making it better...........and for the knowing smiles that cross their faces.......Nando-2011...

    "Silence cannot be Misquoted"--Lazarus Short-2012 "

    " I Just Collect Smiles Craig......Cheap Smiles!-----Fishoz-2017

    "anything can be done, it's finding the easiest way that's hard"-----Bobbysdad--2014

    " Synth percussion is deadly to children, house pets and shitty power supplies"---Stephen Evans 2014

    " You have not reached the point of diminishing returns, you've just ran out of money

    " The Pioneer U-24, unfortunately, is just too expensive and rare to find. That's why I have one."--Nando-2014

  5. #5
    Administrator jbeckva's Avatar
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    Errm... Ey Vatos!!!!
    I think the effectiveness of swapping one definitely does depend on the circuit overall. So I do agree to that fact, but I think what he's missing is that a better engineered op amp design has the capability of performing better, hence the better sound. In my experience it's been sometimes hit and miss, but when the circuit itself can support the new design it really does make a huge difference in noise, clarity and soundstage. The other obvious thing with vintage gear is one shouldn't just "stop" at the op amps, since chances are good that a recap along with a swap will be the best strategy.

    So yeah, it's like rolling the dice sometimes (which corresponds to why I think "rolling op amps" is an appropriate phrase).
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    Forum Veteran nakdoc's Avatar
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    Hmmm. Too many disagree. First, many high end designers use tricks like pulling the opamp's class B output stage down so it runs class A. Not every opamp can do this! In a sense, the designer is "hacking" the opamp to get a better sonic result.
    I read a wonderful article authored by a tube amp designer where he discussed the feedback problem (s). His primary point was that designers with a huge amount of open loop gain are likely to be very lazy in circuit design because the feedback will fix it. Indeed the whole concept of the opamp is that they behave almost at the theoretical "ideal" opamp model that practical limitations (like the author cited an opamp headphone amp driving 60 ohm phones) get ignored. If we know one thing about audio, there is a difference between theory and the real thing.
    Do all opamps sound alike? I can't comment. Do I think a 2 triode line stage preamp sounds better than an opamp preamp? Yes. Why is is better? Which is the simple design? Which would you think best fits "less is more"?
    Did any of you ever own the Dynaco PAT5? I had a PAT4 (all discrete) in college, but switched to a PAT 5 (one opamp in line stage) when I scored a big used system. The PAT 5 was brighter, and I didn't like it. Since I had sold the PAT 4, I moved on to the APT Holman preamp. Now I had more opamps in the signal path, but the sound made me happy for many years. More is more could be the lesson here, or the opamps may have been better, OR, the designer used care in designing the whole amp and didn't fall into lazy traps. I doubt we could measure or analyze these 3 preamps enough to learn what we might about opamps vis a vis audio, but I bet a bunch of you know and experienced exactly what I am describing.

  7. #7
    Forum Veteran Gibsonian's Avatar
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    If all opamps sounded the same I really don't think we'd have nearly as many.

    Saying all opamps sound the same is akin to saying all amps sound the same. To be sure there are many that say this same thing.


    Don't agree with much that guy has to say. My experience differs greatly from his reported myths.

  8. #8
    Forum Veteran nakdoc's Avatar
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    Opamps are environmentally sensitive to the surrounding circuit, and it is easy to cite one situation which creates audible differences in sound. Audio may be designed for limited bandwidth, say 1Hz to 20kHz, or it may be "wideband" DC to 1 MHz. Any opamp with limited gain bandwidth product, poor high frequency current limitations (slew rate), or time delay phase shifts is going to behave and sound different in the wideband circuit.

  9. #9
    Forum Veteran Netfly's Avatar
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    ---
    Quote Originally Posted by 8991XJ View Post
    ... he said the opa2134 will sound the same as an ne5532 ..
    looks to be the same as a ne5533, which has slightly better specs.
    http://www.ti.com/sitesearch/docs/un...nkId=8&src=top


    Interesting read. I agree with some of it, not all.

  10. #10
    Administrator Gepetto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netfly View Post
    looks to be the same as a ne5533, which has slightly better specs.
    http://www.ti.com/sitesearch/docs/un...nkId=8&src=top


    Interesting read. I agree with some of it, not all.
    OPA2134 has significantly different specs than an NE5533 does.

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